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With A Shout!

In this part of our study, the following pre-tribulational claims will be examined:

But we don't want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, that you grieve as do the rest who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus Died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who alive will remain until the coming of the Lord, shall not precede those who have fallen asleep.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel with the trumpet of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and thus we shall always be with the Lord.

Therefore comfort one another with these words.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 NASB

In this letter to the Thessalonian church, Paul  informed the brethren of those who have fallen asleep (died as Christians). They were grieving as those who aren't saved. He said that if we believe Jesus died and rose again, God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. Those who are alive and remain until the Lord's coming will not precede those who died before that time.

Then Paul described the part of the Lord's Coming.

He told them to comfort one another in knowing that the dead in Jesus will return with Him.

The pre-tribbers claim this happens before the tribulation. And since this is happens along with the scene described in First Corinthians chapter 15: "we will all be changed, in a moment within a twinkling of an eye...," this will go unnoticed by the non believers who are "left behind" (We will cover First Corinthians chapter 15  in another study "Twinkling of an Eye") when the church is caught up and Jesus brings the church back with Him into heaven.

They also believe The Lord's  coming is in two "phases:" the first, before the tribulation when He "raptures the church out;" in order to bring  the Jews back into the picture; and the second, when Jesus returns to do battle against the Anti-christ.

Another part of the pre-tribber's belief is that the resurrection for the Just will happen twice: the first at the Lord's "first phase" coming, where the dead in Christ will rise; the second at His "second phase" coming when the Lord resurrects the Old Testament Jews and the martyred "tribulation saints."

The pre-tribbers take issue of this passage in First Thessalonians because it doesn't describe the Lord's "touching down."  And since, they assume the Lord doesn't "touch down" on earth, this means He is going back into heaven. And since he doesn't touch down, this is the pre-trib rapture.

Since they claim that Jesus doesn't "touch down on earth," can we end this study right now and conclude that this is Jesus' "pre-trib coming?" Or should we continue and examine this scripture to see if this a "pre-trib" coming?

Does Paul say Jesus and the church will be brought into heaven by reading this part of First Thessalonians? Since he doesn't, can we conclude this just by reading this passage that they are?

Does Paul say "this" coming will be "secret" to the non believers?  Since he doesn't, can we conclude  this just by reading this passage that it will? 

Let's look further. Jesus is descending from heaven with a "shout" and with a "voice of the archangel" and the "trumpet of God."  Does this sound like an unnoticed event?  For example, If there was an atomic blast, a bomb goes off somewhere in a populated area like Los Angeles, will the people in the area and from miles around hear a loud noise? When they do, wouldn't most of them go out side to see what's going on? Paul says there will be a "shout," a "voice of the archangel," and a "trumpet of God." Wouldn't these sounds be loud enough to be heard by Christians? And then If these sounds are that loud, wouldn't everybody else hear it? Does it say that these sounds go unnoticed? since it doesn't, can we therefore conclude this is a "secret" coming?

Does Paul point out that this "coming of the Lord" will be the Lord's "Pre-tribulational" coming? Does he say "before the tribulation, at the coming of the Lord?" Since he doesn't, then can we conclude just by reading this passage that it is? 

When the Lord's coming is referred to in scriptures, there are descriptions such as "He appears," "all eyes will see Him," "the appearance of" are used. Sometimes there is no mention of an appearing. Can we conclude that since there is no reference to an appearing in those scriptures, that they refer to a  "pre-trib" coming?  Can the Pre-tribbers point out in scriptures where they say  the Coming of the Lord is "secret" to those who are unbelievers? Can they point out in scripture where it says "Before the tribulation Jesus will round up the church and bring them back with Him into heaven?"

So, then the pre-trib assumptions cannot be proven by these scriptures the fourth chapter in First Thessalonians.

To continue with the "touching down," in the following passages of the scriptures where Jesus' coming is seen after the tribulation: Matthew 24:29-31; Mark 14:24-27; Luke 21:25-28; Revelation 1:7; Revelation 19:11-21,do any of these say He is "touching down" on earth? These references are clearly post-tribulational and do not describe Jesus "touching down on" earth.  Therefore we can conclude the 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 passage is post-tribulational as well!

Is there anywhere in scripture that describes a post-tribulation rapture? In The first two Gospels, Jesus describes his coming. In Matthew:

But immediately after the tribulation of those days (great tribulation, v. 21),THE SUN WILL BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE UP ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of heaven will be shaken, and then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will morn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power of great glory. And He will send forth His angels with A GREAT TRUMPET and THEY WILL GATHER TOGETHER  His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other.

          Matthew 24:29-31, NASB

 

Jesus says He will gather his elect from the four winds from one end of the earth of the sky to the other. The pre-tribbers claim that this isn't a rapture because nobody from heaven is brought back with Jesus. If what they are saying is so, is this the only scripture we can go with to establish their conclusion? Aren't there others?  In Mark:
 

"But in those days, after that tribulation...they will see THE SON OF MAN COMING IN THE CLOUDS with great power and great power and  glory. And then He send forth the angels, and will gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest end of the earth, and the farthest end of Heaven."

               Mark 13:24-27 NASB

 

Jesus Says in Mark He will gather His elect "from the four winds, from the farthest end of the earth, and the farthest end of Heaven." Isn't He bringing back the ones who have died in Christ? And they are gathered together with the ones alive on earth. Isn't He describing the rapture?

Looking back at: "God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus...," "...we who alive will remain until the coming of the Lord, shall not precede those who have fallen asleep ..., "... and the dead in Christ shall rise first...," Paul is saying the ones who are alive shall not precede the ones who have fallen asleep.  He also says the dead in Jesus shall  rise first. This is the key part of this passage in First Thessalonians and it rests on when the dead arise. 

Are there two resurrections for the Just, as pre-tribbers claim, or is the dead in Christ raised after the tribulation?

 In the gospel of John, Jesus' friend, Lazarus died while Jesus was returning to Bethany. Martha, Lazarus' sister meets Jesus. He tells her that Lazarus is asleep. And Jesus tells her "Your brother shall rise again." Martha responds:

 

"I know that he will rise again at the resurrection on the last day."

 John 11:23 NASB

Martha, a Jew knew there was a resurrection on the last day.

Pre-tribbers believe that resurrection is after the tribulation. Jesus, earlier in John said:

 

"...And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that all He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of My Father that everyone who beholds the son and believes Him, may have eternal life; and I myself will rise him up on the last day."

 "No one comes to me, unless the Father who sent me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day."

He who eats My flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day"

                                                                                 

John 6:39-40, 44, 54 NASB

In these above verses, everyone who beholds and believes in Jesus, He will raise them up on the last day.  Does this  happen before the Tribulation?  Who will be risen up on the last day? If  Jesus says everyone who believes in Him, doesn't this include the saints who die during the tribulation? Since dead tribulation saints can't be risen before the tribulation, they are raised after the tribulation. Therefore, we must conclude all  who believe in Jesus will be risen at the last day, after the tribulation.

As wee look further into John, Jesus said to his disciples:

"He who believes in Me does not believe in Me, but in Him who sent Me. And he who beholds me beholds the one who sent Me. I have come as light unto the world, that everyone who believes in Me may not remain in darkness. And if everyone hears My sayings, and does not keep them, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.

"He who rejects me, and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day."

John 12:48

In this part of scripture, Jesus says the one who rejects His sayings, is judged by the words He spoke at the last day.

One thing we do know, Jesus does not come in this instance before the tribulation. The one who rejects Jesus will be judged by the words He spoke at the last day which is after the tribulation. And all who believe in Jesus will be raised on the last day!

John in another book describes a scene in Revelation after the tribulation:

  "...I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given to them. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of the testimony of Jesus and because of the word of God and those who had not worshiped the beast or his image...and they came and to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were completed. This is the first resurrection..."

          Revelation 20:4-6 NASB

In the above scripture, the ones who came to life were martyred because of

 These include all martyrs in Christ. John said "this is the first resurrection." John didn't say this is the "second phase of the first resurrection," as pre-tribbers claim.  Can they point out in Revelation there is a "first phase of the first resurrection" before this one? If this is the first resurrection, can there a resurrection before this one?

Since there's only one resurrection for the just which is after the tribulation and the ones who are alive at the coming of the Lord cannot be caught up before the dead in Christ are raised. Therefore, we must conclude there is no pre-tribulation rapture.
 
 

"...I saw under the alter of souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they maintained. They called out in a loud voice, 'How long, oh sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?'"

Revelation 6:9-10 NIV